From: cluster.user@yale.edu (Cluster User)
Subject: Re: The Bulgars are Bulgars (Re: Caucasoid Turks/Bulgars)
Date: 10 May 1999 00:00:00 GMT
Message-ID: <3736783f.35911367@news.yale.edu>
References: <36ca073a.16343620@news.yale.edu> <36cca3ed.14676934@news.yale.edu> <36cca75c.15555467@news.yale.edu> <36cf2980.190197920@news.yale.edu> <36dee7fa.108219411@news.yale.edu> <36e40f21.4849643@news.yale.edu> <7c6hs4$va@cpca3.uea.ac.uk> <36f6aeef.439178515@news.yale.edu> <7dajnt$ssk$1@nnrp1.dejanews.com> <7ei51h$4m5$1@news.ox.ac.uk> <370cf95d.8677457@news.yale.edu> <7en884$1t8@cpca3.uea.ac.uk> <3712427B.DA4346AA@mbay.net> <3713a994.660219@news.yale.edu> <371BFCD7.98263C22@montclair.edu> <372220bb.143446995@news.yale.edu> <37226EDB.7038A129@montclair.edu> <7fuohl$ori@cpca3.uea.ac.uk> <372f5c62.91986990@news.yale.edu> <372f5cbe.92079743@news.yale.edu> <7gp50a$cct@cpca3.uea.ac.uk> <3734b8cd.146733852@news.yale.edu> <3736019e.9033128@news.yale.edu>
Organization: Yale University
Newsgroups: sci.lang

On Sun, 09 May 1999 21:44:35 GMT, cluster.user@yale.edu (Cluster User)
wrote:


>
>>"pamirian" "alem" (alam, olam) and "tvirem" (tijorem, tiram, diverem)
>>denoted the beginning and the end of the harvest, correspondingly. Z.
>>Lenz in "Zeitrechnung im Nuristan. Berlin, 1938, had that the
>>"pamirians" (I wonder whether he means the nuristani) celebrated the
>>New year twice - as "Nauruz-i-olam" (initial New Year) and, the
>
>I don't know what is meant by these words. if it really means "first"
>it is not common in iranian. it could be a combined arabic - iranian
>awwal-am as in talysh (which adds the turkic -inci as well!). modern
>persian prefers awwal (a"vva"l) to the native word. it cold also be
>an archaic loan from turkic. or even arabic `a:lam (world, i.e.
>standard)
>
>>second festival - "Nauruz-i-tiramokh" (literally "New year in the
>
>ti:r ma:h (with -h, it might be a transcription error on the part of
>dobrev as he does not distinguish -h and -x in new persian ti:r 
>means arrow, ma:h means moon or month; I don't know if this is the 
>correct etymology for ti:r which is avestan ti*sh*tryehe). soghdian 

at any rate, it is apparently the name of a divinity.

>and xwarezmian had the new year in the beginning of summer (as in 
>nuristan) and this did in fact coincide with the persian (4th) 
>month of ti^r.
>
>>month of the end of the harvest", i.e. Autumn New Year.) Besides the
>>pamirians, a similar term for the month when the harvest is completed
>>is found among the neighbouring dardic peoples. Among them one of the
>>months is called "diver" and it is regarded as particularly important
>>as at that time the harvesters return from their summer camps."
>>
>