From: e.karloukovski@uea.ac.uk (Vassil Karloukovski)
Subject: Re: Caucasoid Turks/Bulgars
Date: 20 Apr 1999 00:00:00 GMT
Message-ID: <7fhmfc$h91@cpca3.uea.ac.uk>
References: <369E3BE1.5C45@sbu.ac.uk> <77li2j$qi0$1@whisper.globalserve.net> <369F52FE.2B6@sbu.ac.uk> <77rc86$auj$1@brokaw.wa.com> <36A444B3.F3B70F1C@alum.mit.edu.-> <7827sb$269$1@nnrp1.dejanews.com> <36A52D70.9E372DD2@alum.mit.edu.-> <36A556AB.9927BD29@montclair.edu> <36a63533.58309714@news.yale.edu> <7866ud$i9m$1@nnrp1.dejanews.com> <36cdb21e.883120019@news.wxs.nl> <36A7FCC8.79790A6B@earthlink.net> <36d77e23.1000882888@news.wxs.nl> <36a8d455.81661202@news.yale.edu> <78pl3c$84o@cpca3.uea.ac.uk> <36b0dc2f.3434839@news.yale.edu> <78v30o$vl6@cpca3.uea.ac.uk> <36b34d7c.60430113@news.yale.edu> <794e84$4iq@cpca3.uea.ac.uk> <3744d12a.1873763068@news.wxs.nl> <796m95$eq2@cpca3.uea.ac.uk> <375c0ea6.1954957123@news.wxs.nl> <79fo99$qkl@cpca3.uea.ac.uk> <371a3f79.4770940@news.yale.edu>
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII
Organization: University of East Anglia, Norwich, U.K.
Mime-Version: 1.0
Newsgroups: sci.archaeology,sci.anthropology,sci.lang

In article <371a3f79.4770940@news.yale.edu>, cluster.user@yale.edu says...
>VassIl Karloukovski communicated to me:
 
>>Next, if there is a non-iranian layer, why compare it only to turkic? 
>
>this is not true.

I meant that you compared it only to turkic. Probably they could be other,
closer parallels to those non-iranian, turkic-like words you found.

...

>>not in 
>>any way contradict to the history of central asian peoples moving into 
>>Bactria, etc. (the formation of the kushans).
>
>? interesting. please elaborate.


I meant these other, non-linguistic similarities - the artificial skull 
deformation in up to 70% of the skulls in bulgar necropolises from the Balkans,
and the similar practice among the Kushans. V. Nikonorov in "The armies of
Bactria, 700 BC - 450 AD" (1997) has a nice picture of a kushan warrior with
a melon-like, conical head. :-)) Next, the peaked caps, apparently characteristic 
both to the danube and volga bulgars, and similar high caps among some of 
the saka tribes (up to the sakas of the state of Kroraina in the Tarim basin). 
Further similarities in drawings/rock reliefs of bulgar and kushan warrior
costumes - short caftans fastened by horizontal braids, etc. 

Having in mind this as well as that the Kushans might have had some central-
asian components, the result of the chain reaction and the migrations triggered 
by the hsiung-hu, why not consider that some of these central asian words in 
bulgar (bulgar "somor", mouse - turkic "sIchkan", but also the tungus "szomor"; 
bulgar "eth", dog - turkic "it", but also tungus "etek"; bulgar "toh", cock - 
turkic "tauk", but also the tungus "togo"; etc.) could have been a north 
central asian legacy?

I don't understand this your fixation on the Kuban basin as the place of contact,
of acquisition of these r-turkic or tungus, whatever, words. The slight mongoloidity 
among the bulgars was an old central asian trait, well before their movement to
Kuban.


VK